CD: Oh my.

JF: So then he had just his butt out. But you didn’t really expect it, he didn’t look like someone that was just gonna be like, “This is whatever, this is my body, this is me.” Afterwards, he got approached by this S&M couple and they asked if he wanted to have a threesome.

CD: Did he?

JF: I think he did, because he wouldn’t tell me what he said as an answer. And I think that must be a yes.

CD: Yeah, you never would say — you never would be like, “I won’t tell you what I said. It was no. I said no.” On a totally different subject: How do you make the calculations between art that you want to make and the art that pays money?

JF: Right now, I don’t feel like I have a way of making a whole bunch of money. If I have an idea, I have a sense now for if it will work out or not. Sometimes I have a show that I really want to do, but I don’t think people will come to it right away. I think maybe people would come after a year.

I try to be a little more sensible now. Before, I used to do these shows that were crazy. One time I did a show that had a cast of 60 people. It was so nuts. I was certain to lose money and I really thought I wouldn’t. I flew in this Liza Minnelli impersonator, I put him up. I really did all this crazy shit and then nobody really came. I even had a potato chips sponsor. It was like, “Why, why, why?”